When Blasphemy becomes Freedom of Speech
We all heard about the incident of the offensive caricatures depicting Prophet Mohamed (PBUH) that were published in Denmark and Norway, and witnessed the outrageous chain of events all around the Muslim world, whether it being the withdrawal of ambassadors, the closure of embassies or the recent world wide calls of boycott that stretched out to reach the local grocery store right behind the corner.
It’s absolutely sickening to see the level some people could stoop down to, crossing all red lines of respect to religions and faiths, and renaming public mockery of cultural beliefs and values to “Freedom of Speech”.
The Danish government has broad public backing for it stance on the cartoons. An opinion poll showed that 79 percent of Danes think Fogh Rasmussen should not issue an apology and 62 percent say the newspaper should not apologize. (Source)
I just can’t help but compare this to the recent floating thoughts of holocaust denial that were raised again by President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad, and the spur of international outrageous cries of denial and rejection, bearing in mind the differences between the two issues, one being a religious belief, the other being a suspicious contreversial historical event.
“suspicious historical event“? suspicious?
Speechless. Absolultely speechless.
The point about the holocaust is that there is not the slightest doubt that this genocide happened. People who try to cast doubt on it seem to be saying “It didn’t happen but if it did it was a good thing.” It is true that it is hard to believe anyone would want to kill millions of Jews and gypsies, but there are some people alive today who would like all the people in Israel to be killed.
Brutal murder is in a completely different class from humour. Those cartoons are not at all offensive. I have seen much stronger cartoons about Jesus, God, Mary and other characters in the Christian religion. Humour has to be about serious topics, such as religion, terrorism, death or sex.
Muslims need to get used to the idea that their religion is a subject for jokes and comment, like any other religion. If you don’t like the jokes, ignore them.
Freedom of speech means you have the right to say what you want, regardless if it offends others. Sure, you’ll hear some dumb and insulting things, but a lot of offensive opinions turn out to be good ideas. Galileo, for example, who said the earth went around the sun.
This is how societies progress. Stifle the speaking of offensive opinions and your society will stagnate.
Others are not legally obligated to respect your religion. Neither are you obligated to respect theirs. It makes for better social relations if we all voluntarily do so, but when you demand the government censor stuff you don’t like, you’re establishing a dictatorial state.
Muslims need to stop being so sensitive. I’ve seen far worse insults directed at Christianity and Judaism and millions of Christians and Jews don’t get into an uproar.
Rasmussen can’t do anything about it. Only a court of law can intervene. Politicians have nothing to say about what a newspaper can or cannot publish. That’s called freedom of press. Whitout freedom of press, there is no democracy.
Muslims need to get used to the idea that their religion is a subject for jokes and comment, like any other religion. If you don’t like the jokes, ignore them” by Don Cox.
And people who demonstrate and invoke such activates need to get used to the fact that there are vast number of people who are willing to take countermeasures from arguments to whatever seems necessary. You Don Cox talk for your own tongue about making jokes about other religions. I as Muslim, I have been taught NEVER EVER to disbelief that there were other messengers e.g. Jesus (POH), Moses (POH). We have been taught to respect others, respect different religious, cultures, races etc. Therefore, respect us as we respect you. If you want to make jokes, knock yourself making jokes with other countless topics. Why when Muslims condemn such hideous things, the entire World starts to defended and justify what happened as freedom of speech? While the historian Mr. David Irving who was practising his right of “freedom of speech” about the Holocaust was imprisoned and might be imprisoned for 10 years? Why should Muslim take it and not the Zionists too?
“Freedom of speech means you have the right to say what you want, regardless if it offends others. Sure, you’ll hear some dumb and insulting things, but a lot of offensive opinions turn out to be good ideas. Galileo, for example, who said the earth went around the sun.
This is how societies progress. Stifle the speaking of offensive opinions and your society will stagnate.” By Great Red Spot.
You dumbass, you are inciting that making jokes about Islam would develop societies? Our “society” was so developed when Mohammed Peace Be upon Him ruled and created a perfect foundation to what was known as Islam World that enabled the Muslims to conquer major science subjects. Do you know while the western societies were in the dark ages e.g. plagues, domestic wars, corruptions, tyranny, slaves and masters and so on? The Muslims have made innovations and gained wealthy knowledge in major science subjects these are but not limited to Maths, Medicine, Astronomy, chemistry and so on? (Moreover, guess who came and robed us naked of our knowledge?)
Mohammed was illiterate but that does not mean he was not such an outstanding genius. He for example have invented a system known as Zakat (a system that is compulsive for any healthy working adult Muslim to extract some money he/she earns based of static figures, so it then gets distributed to poor people). That is a system similar to Social Security Act (it is kind of system that taxes rich people and the gathered money is distributed to poor people) in America for example? However, the latter was created not longer than 71 years ago and Zakat 1400 years ago can you believe it?
When did America give women their rights? Not more than 30 years ago? This was after the Women Strike For Equality! While Mohammed gave the women their right and punished whoever practised the dark ages habits of Arabs where they used to (before Islam) bury young girls because they were thought of source of shame and embarrassment. He gave women the right to make big decisions in battles, societies and announced her as the best school to build good healthy Islamic society and so on. In addition, I can go on about Muhammad but my life would end before I can reach the first fractions of his divine actions.
“Others are not legally obligated to respect your religion. Neither are you obligated to respect theirs. It makes for better social relations if we all voluntarily do so, but when you demand the government censor stuff you don’t like, you’re establishing a dictatorial state.” By Great Red Spot.
We are not like you, we are obligated to respect other religions, and we are respectful people. We are proud of respecting others! As I aforementioned, you or anyone who wants to joke, you have ANYTHING to talk about, joke about your mum, your sisters, your country, anything, but damn, just leave our religion alone. Understand this; religion to us is like pinching us, yes PINCHING us! Do you like to be pinched? We definitely do not.
“Muslims need to stop being so sensitive. I’ve seen far worse insults directed at Christianity and Judaism and millions of Christians and Jews don’t get into an uproar”
First, DO NOT compare Christianity and Judaism with Islam, Islam is unique, its nothing like the any other religion, and a matter of fact its Holly Book hasn’t been modified contrariwise to other religions, where their Holly Books were modified to what “secret/dark societies” main goals.
If you look at BBC and other UK major news agencies, search in their pages for Sunday or church attendance! You will find out that Islam delivers the feeling and knowledge that other religions lack off delivering, and this my friend is a opportunity you will not taste or understand how it works. We are not like Jewish, or Christians, or any other religion, we are unique we are Muslims, we have the word jealously imprinted on our foreheads, we are jealous on our religion. Our religion delivers something to us that you and any other brainy atheist philosophiser would understand. Jewish, and Christians do not care about marking their religion holy pillars with ugly and embarrassing symbols why? Because it does not deliver the sensation and information, that Islam has. In this paragraph I have went in a loop just to try and bury the point into your brain.
Our religion delivers something to us that you and any other brainy atheist philosophiser would NOT understand. Jewish, and Christians do not care about marking their religion holy pillars look ugly and embarrassing, they as well add symbols that would lower it to the ground why? Because it does not deliver the sensation and information, that Islam has. In this paragraph I have went in a loop just to try and bury the point into your brain.
“And people who demonstrate and invoke such activates need to get used to the fact that there are vast number of people who are willing to take countermeasures from arguments to whatever seems necessary.”
What do you mean, ‘whatever seems necessary’? If you were referring to violence, well that should be where freedom of speech stops. Words are just words. Get over it.
Let’s get some facts straight here:
1.I –along with many other Muslims- believe that asking for an apology from either the government of Denmark or the newspaper itself is absolutely ridiculous and absurd; additionally, those voices that recently floated around the Arab world calling for implication of laws that will control the published press and enforce respect for other religions, this is intervening in another country’s internal matters and should not be tolerated; those that stand for such bullshit speak for themselves and few of their blind followers, not me.
2. The Danish have the right to freedom of speech (regardless of whether theirs agree with our definition which includes respect to other religious cultures and faiths), Muslims also have the right to boycott Danish products and protest their anger by emails or demonstration, the newspaper should’ve understood the sensitivity of the matter and is now responsible for the consequences.
3. My personal frustration on the issue arise not from the fact that it was mockery of a religious matter, but that of that someone who calls himself a journalist did not have the decency to respect a messenger of god who called for respect of all faiths and all religious belief that came before his, depicting him as someone who calls for death, destruction and inexcusable blood shedding is absolutely unnecessary, what exactly was the message that he wanted to send through by those cartoons?
Watchdog;
You said “First, DO NOT compare Christianity and Judaism with Islam, Islam is unique, its nothing like the any other religion”
Yes, your religion is unique, just like every other religion.
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You said “We are not like you, we are obligated to respect other religions, and we are respectful people. We are proud of respecting others!”
The hate against Jews, Christians, and non-Muslims that is spewing out of some of your mosques indicates otherwise.
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You said “You dumbass, you are inciting that making jokes about Islam would develop societies?”
Joking about religions highlights their ridiculous or outdated aspects and pushes them to reform. Islam still has to learn this lesson. When people are drawing Mohammad with a bomb in his turban, ask yourself why. It’s a very concise criticism about the violent turn your religion has taken. Rather than complaining and threatening boycotts, fix what’s causing Islam to be perceived so negatively by outsiders.
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You said “Do you know while the western societies were in the dark ages e.g. plagues, domestic wars, corruptions, tyranny, slaves and masters and so on? The Muslims have made innovations and gained wealthy knowledge in major science subjects these are but not limited to Maths, Medicine, Astronomy, chemistry and so on?”
War, corruption, tyranny, and slavery existed throughout the Muslim golden age. The Abbasids, the Umayyads, the Almohads, the Safavids were quite familiar with all of them.
You keep reminding everyone of some past golden age, as if that compensates for the intellectual desert of the last 500 centuries. It doesn’t.
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You said “When did America give women their rights? Not more than 30 years ago? This was after the Women Strike For Equality!”
There was no such thing as the “Women Strike for Equality”. There was a Women’s Liberation Movement, wherein women demanded greater representation in society. However, American women had rights far longer than 30 years ago. They got the vote in 1928. Throughout the entire period of American history, they had the right to marry whomever they chose, they had inheritance rights, the right to education, the right to work, and so forth.
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Emoodz;
You said “what exactly was the message that he wanted to send through by those cartoons?”
See my reply to Watchdog in the third paragraph. Secondly, not all people recognize Mohammad as a messenger of God.
Great Red Spot:
Away from what I think about the cartoon issue, I quote you:
“Joking about religions highlights their ridiculous or outdated aspects and pushes them to reform. ”
If you want to fix a religion, fix your own, Muslims didn’t complain to you or ask for your advice to fix their religion, it’s simply non of your business how ridiculous (if you argue so) our religion is. If it’s ridiculous then that’s totally our problem. No one asked you to be a Muslim, or a Sikh or Hindu so let people be what they deem right.
I have no right to criticize Hindus “in order to push them to reform”. Apparently, they are happy about what they are and that’s their own business. I fail to see what right you, or anyone has to appoint themselves as religion “fixers”, it is not your religion, leave it to its people. You don’t like it, don’t follow it, no one asked for your advice about how it can be “fixed”.
Thank you
Watchdog
As a Muslim, your replies to Great red spot really Pissed me off
I hope you have an answer to what great red spot said about the Islamic old days you are bragging about. Go and read what Abbasids and Umayyad did. Tyranny and oppression attached all Muslims history as well as others like the west. Thus, our history is not brighter than the others and that should not make you proud of it.
Secondly, until when we Muslims will stop this mantra of how we were innovative and intellectual while the west was in the dark ages! Let us respect our minds and answer these questions: where are those guys who were in the dark ages while you were allegedly “inventing” things and where are you NOW. Look around you man, everything around you invented by the guys “ who lived the dark ages” or you “ who lived the gold ages”?
With regard to women rights, visit some Islamic courts controlled by filthy turbans and you will see how you Muslims have given women their rights that you are bragging about here.
Secret;
When your radicals kill 3000 of my fellow New Yorkers, and trash my beloved Manhattan skyline in the name of your religion, the reform of your religion IS my business.
Islamic extremists are killing Hindus in India, Christians in the Phillipines, Pakistan, and Europe, and Buddhists in Thailand. When your religion becomes a threat to others, they have every right to tell you to “fix it”.
Thank you.
Yes. As Muslim I totally agree that so many things need to be fixed. The Prophet hadiths need to be re-interpreted and filtered from those fabricated by wahabbis and fanatics beards; we have to challenge the narratives. We have to change the culture of killing and terrorism from our curriculums, sermons and terrorist turbans need to be marginalized. And for those Muslims who want to convince the “others” that our culture is the culture of peace and love, can we really justify the beheading in Iraq in which is done in the name of Islam. It is so unfair to ask the west to fathom the specialties of our societies that the all those killing are done by Wahhabis and fanatics.
GRS:
I will not waste my time discussing what Islam calls for and what Islam is with someone who thinks all Muslims are blood thirsty terrorists, go get your own “Islam for dummies” book now will you; sit down and try to differentiate between Islam and the actions of Muslims.
Muhammed and/or Islam did not call for 9/11, nor does it support any kind of violence; Binladen and those mental terrorists used thier own twisted version of Islam to justify thier actions; you and the folks at Jyllands-Posten’s need to get your facts straight.
And for god’s sake people, freedom of speech of the press is not a defense to the unjustifiable mockery, such granted freedom should be the kind of versatile pretext used only to widen the divide between the West and the Muslim world, respect.. respect..
“If you want to fix a religion, fix your own, Muslims didn’t complain to you or ask for your advice to fix their religion, it’s simply non of your business how ridiculous (if you argue so) our religion is. If it’s ridiculous then that’s totally our problem. No one asked you to be a Muslim, or a Sikh or Hindu so let people be what they deem right.”
Secret,
What you are suggesting is that only a Muslim can have an opinion about Islam. This is an ad hominem argument and inherintly illogical. It’s the same as saying you are only against Isreal because you are an Arab (or a liberal, or a Palestinian, etc).
Everyone is entitled to an opinion, no matter who they are.
Moodz;
You said “I will not waste my time discussing what Islam calls for and what Islam is with someone who thinks all Muslims are blood thirsty terrorists,”
Please re-read my postings again, but more carefully. In all cases where I referred to violence, the word “Extremist” or “radical” was used to differentiate the crazy Muslims from the normal Muslims.
Example 1: “Islamic extremists are killing Hindus in India”
Example 2: “When your radicals kill 3000″
Why is that anytime someone points out that there are radicals among you, some of you take that to mean we think all Muslims are “bloodthirsty terrorists?”
You said “, freedom of speech of the press is not a defense to the unjustifiable mockery”
My own interpretation of this incident is this. Rightly or wrongly, the Europeans are responding to a string of provocations. They were poked in Madrid, and they were poked in London, and they were poked in Holland, and they get poked anytime one of their citizens is kidnapped in Iraq and gets beheaded in the name of Allah’s greatness. Now, they may have chosen an ignorant and disrespectful response, but publishing these cartoons all over Europe is their way of poking back.
I hope that everyone discussing here has actually looked at all the cartoons in question. They seem to me to be very mild, considering the insults we have had to put up with from Muslims recently.
The best way to deal with Islamic extremism is indeed by mockery. Craziness is absurd, and that needs pointing out.
The claims that Islam tolerates and respects other religions can be countered by the complete absense of any churches or synagogues in Saudi Arabia, and the steady process of driving Jews and Hristians out of all the Muslim countries in the Middle East. You may remember also the persecution of Christians in East Timor.
I think all these religions are as irrational as each other, and the more jokes about them the better.
Tariq:
“What you are suggesting is that only a Muslim can have an opinion about Islam.”
No, I’m not. I am only suggesting that changes or whatever “filtering of Hadiths” Jaffar is calling for should be done by the Muslims themselves, and certainly not any outsider who thinks the religion is absurd.
Jaffar:
I never said I was against change itself, I am though against politically motivated changes by outsiders!
I do not see the filtering of Hadith business having anything to do but with the Muslims themselves, they should do it and deal with it, not anyone else.
@ Don Cox
“…
Why is the insult so deeply felt by some Muslims?
Of course, there is the prohibition on images of Muhammad.
But one cartoon, showing the Prophet wearing a turban shaped as a bomb with a burning fuse, extends the caricature of Muslims as terrorists to Muhammad.
In this image, Muslims see a depiction of Islam, its prophet and Muslims in general as terrorists.
This will certainly play into a widespread perception among Muslims across the world that many in the West harbour a hostility towards – or fear of – Islam and Muslims.” – BBC Online (see http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/4674864.stm)
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@ Great Red Spot
Listen, you claimed that radicals killed 3000 of your fellow New Yorkers or whatsoever without any proof except what the CIA have told you what they want you to know. For example they had the nerve to say that there was a third plane hit the Pentagon, therefore I recommand you to look at this site http://www.pentagonstrike.co.uk/flash.htm. Now, tell me, what did your President do when he was informed that United States of America was under attack while he was at some kids school? If you don’t know I recommand you visit this site http://www.thememoryhole.org/911/bush-911.htm (there are dozens available upon request). Now, 3000 fellow new yorks were killed, I am sorry to hear that, but how many U.S. soldiers were sent to death by George W. Bush since going into war with Iraq? 2248 soldiers (see ), I do not care about you, or your “fellow citizens” I care about my brothers in Islam, so the true question is, how many IRAQIES, AFGHANS, and PALESTINIANS were killed by your country? How many Muslims were hideously tortured (physically, and mentally) and humiliated? If you have forgotten, I and Millions of other Muslims and non-Muslims haven’t!
I admit there are there are terrorist amongst us, who claim they are true muslims, but they have lost the right path, they have went away from what true Islam is. We do NOT hate Jews, WE HATE Zionists, WE Do not hate Christians, WE HATE Crusades. We Believe In Moses, We Believe in Jesus Peace be up on them.
Anyways, because you are an American, I know you for sure you are conceited by youself, you think you guys own the world, and I rest my peace here. Just some Questions and Answers for your information for free..
1. Q: What do you call it when a Palestinian youth throws rock to the Jews who have illegally occupied his land?
A: A terrorist attack.
Q: What do you call it when an Israeli Apache Attack-Helicopter fires rockets at Palestinian youths armed with stones?
A: Self-Defense.
2. Q: What do you call a weapon that can kill thousands of people?
A: A weapon of mass destruction (WMD).
Q: What do you call a weapon that has killed more than 2 million Moslems in Iraq and Afghanistan, including more than 500,000 children?
A: U.N Sanctions.
3. Q: What do you call it when 20 Christians or Jewish people are slaughtered?
A: A massacre.
Q: What do you call it when more than 2,000,000 Moslems in Iraq and Afghanistan are slaughtered by the US at a loss of a few hundred American forces (many of whom were killed by friendly fire)?
A: War against Terrorism.
4. Q: What is the name of the leader wrongly accused of trying to create an ethnically pure Greater Serbia?
A: Slobodan Milosevic, ‘war criminal’.
Q: What is the name of the leader trying to annihilate the entire Palestinian Moslems in the attempt to ethnically pure Greater Israel?
A: Ariel Sharon, ‘a man of peace’.
5. Q: What do you call it when innocent Christians or Jews are killed by those resisting a brutal occupation?
A: Terrorism.
Q: What do you call it when millions of innocent Moslems in Palestine, Afghanistan and Iraq are killed by an occupying army?
A: Collateral damage (self-defense).
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THE TRUTH ABOUT ISLAM, JUDAISM & CHRISTIANITY
by Heddy S. Permadi Aria Wirasmara
The history of humankind will never be able to toss aside the vitality of the role of our religious beliefs. You might say that there has almost never been a single world’s crucial historical event that there was no religious aspect in it, until it forms the shape of our world today.
Even today, in the face of our almost secular world, religions are still the base of some of our world’s social and political problems to say the least. Nowadays, the diversity of religions and economic interests prove to form a deadly combination in originating most of our world’s wars and conflicts. However, it does not require an acute observer to be able to identify that the Christians & Jews disharmony with the Moslems has been the major force behind it all.
So what is up with them? I am fully aware that: None of this can be solved by simple observation, as all of them have been put together in dialogues and debates that ended in deadlock. But then again the question remains! What is up with them??
Islam as a religion actually shares striking similarities with Judaism as its primordial counterpart in history, turn of events, and teachings. Islam and Judaism remain a vibrant, cultural and religious force that enforces their followers to always return to the ‘old ways’ in order to preserve it undefiled. Christianity however, it’s Vatican make sure that Christianity will keep growing by changing and assimilating to suits the needs of our post-modern world today in searching for seemingly endless perfection.
However! it is interesting to know that Holly Quran illustrates the journey Muhammad’s predecessors with the likes of Moses, and Jesus, etc., and even reveals some of the basic principal of their teachings as well.
So how can one know the trustworthiness of one prophet’s scriptures?
Do Islam and Judaism really share the same vibrant in originality and authenticity?
Or does Christianity today represent better to our moral need?
Do we just pretend that these religions are all the same?
Is it important for one to decide if any of these religions corrupted or supercedes?
I will not arm my writing with archeological, science, and numerological facts, etc. But instead, I will submit primarily to a conversation I made with a Catholic woman priest and a Moslem priest who both claimed to have done their own researches on the subject.
So why does Quran illustrate Jewish prophets’ journeys and teachings?
And how on earth did Prophet Mohammad have his share of Jewish scriptures and Bible teachings?
According to Islam basic teachings and confirmed by the Moslem Priest, it is known for a fact that the prophet Muhammad was an illiterate until the day he passed away. This negates any possibility of the study of any Jewish Scriptures and Bible’s Testaments as Muhammad has never taken any tutoring in Jewish scriptures and Bible’s teachings in any form in his lifetime. And there is no way to prove it otherwise that he was assisted by his disciples as there are historical evidences that prove that he spent his entire time alone in a cave called Heera during the revelations. (the basic Islam theology teaches that Allah sent Gabriel down with the Quran to Muhammad in Heera cave, and that Gabriel’s first word was “Read!”, which was probably implied to Muhammad’s illiterate condition).
But does this suffice that the Quran is the ultimate word of God?
Does this justify that Muhammad completes and fulfills the mission and ministry of all existing Jewish prophets including Moses and Jesus?
Does this sustain the idea that the Islam completes Judaism and Christianity?
Christianity however, the Bible has clearly mentioned that the Lord Jesus Christ has given an instruction for Christians to evaluate the teachings of any prophet that comes after him (the fruit inspection).
But does this evaluation to be applied only externally?
Can the Christians apply it internally too?
Easy answer! Almost all of any residing religious beliefs that we know on this earth unquestionably forbids internal evaluation of their doctrines and dogmas. It is considered blasphemy and heresy. This is known and certain for a fact.
But even as a devout Christians, can you deny the endowment of your intellectual gift and submit to these religious dogmas without giving your mind a chance to free itself to a judgment base on new facts and findings?
I’m not here to rock the boat with more disharmonies, but rather just try to accommodate what supposed to be the truth. But firstly you may want to listen to my conversation with a woman priest who claimed that she accidentally found these new facts and findings from old manuscripts found in church library, and she said: that she is under suspicion that Christianity does procure a load of human tampering and distortions in its doctrines and dogmas.
According to her findings, they affirm that Christianity is after all a hybrid man-made religion which was generated by a process of combining two religions, a process known as Transmogrification, which in this case Christianity, and Sol Invictus as the incumbent religion in the Roman Empire, architected by none other than the King Constantine himself. It was a brilliant maneuver from the Pagan King to unify the nation of Rome under his banner.
According to the old manuscripts, it is known for a fact that any existing rituals of the incumbent Sun God worshipping Pagans are merged into Christianity by Constantine. For instance, the 25th of December which was originally the birth of God Osiris, Adonis and Dionysus, was then claimed as the birth of Jesus Christ. And the day of worship for the Sun God was then claimed as the Christians’ mass day (Sun-Day).
And then came along the articles of Nicene. It was a religious-article that later governs Christianity as the result of a Concili (meeting between Christian high priests supervised by Constantine) which took place in the city of Niceae. This article practically revised the Old Testament and exalted the immortality of Jesus of Nazareth, which was then claimed as Jesus Christ the Son of God (New Testament). It was the birth of the Trinity of God. And it is said that later on it even washed out any evidences of Jesus of Nazareth marriage with Maria Magdalena in an attempt to justify his divinity and holiness.
So do these ‘religious-truth’ accommodating for devout Christians to see that their beliefs have been nothing more than a mere man-made corrupted religion, and full of human tampering and distortions?
Do these findings sufficient enough to justify them to abstract from their current incumbent Christian doctrines and dogmas?
I doubt it just yet. But one should take a path in journeying through history to finally understand objectively towards this matter.
The HISTORY began a long way back to the time of Prophet Abraham. According to Jewish scriptures, God instructed Abraham to sacrifice his son to demonstrate his faith and devotion to Him. And this is when the contradiction begins. The Jewish scriptures and the Bibles claim that it was Isaac, Abraham’s son from his Jewish wife Sara that God wanted to be sacrificed. While on the other hand, the Quran claims that it was Ishmael, the other Abraham’s son from his Arabian wife Hajr.
Now who would know that these two Abraham’s sons would bestow a consequence of such great magnitude so dire in shaping our world’s religious map today?
As Isaac’s descendants will give birth to great Jewish kings and prophets such as Moses, Suleiman and Jesus, whereas Ishmael’s descendants will give birth to the man none other than the Arabian prophet Muhammad. But let us forget Muhammad for a while. Let us move one to the time of Moses. In the great exodus, the Jews were promised by Moses the Promised Land and…another Messiah! The Messiah told to be the bringer of righteousness, the fulfiller and completer of Moses’ mission and ministry. And it has been a long wait in the dark for the Jews.
And then, centuries later Maria gave birth to her husband-less miracle son Jesus. The Jesus of Nazareth he was, but what is with him? Jesus of Nazareth was a Jewish Royalty His lineage that can be trace back to the great King Suleiman himself. And as a Jewish royalty, it was mandatory for him to be married (it was considered a disgrace to live a life as a bachelor at a certain age).
So did Jesus or did he not married?
Any reasonable, fair and open minded person would now be able to subscribe to the logic that it was simply impossible for Jesus not to be married.
So given the hard evidences, Jesus did marry…to Maria Magdalena.
Again it was simply impossible for him not to, an easy logic. And there is no way of proving otherwise that he didn’t, with the exception of the article of Nicene of course!, which simply stated that Jesus had lived a life of bachelor hood due to his divinity as the son of God, and that Maria Magdalena was a whore. Too simple?
But are we to set aside this fact as irrelevant?
Or on the contrary, do this fact is far more fitting to be conveyed?
This is what we are going to find out. For some reasons, the Jews did not take Jesus’ revelations seriously and did not believe that Jesus was the Messiah promised by Moses. There are suspicions that Jesus simply didn’t live to meet their standard to be their Messiah, as Judaism has grown and developed to be an established religion throughout the centuries from the time of Moses. The Jews were just simply selective and more demanding in evaluating new prophets, particularly with the one who supposed to bring about the ultimate virtue and complete their ministry.
The fact that Jerusalem was ruled under Roman Empire at the time, just worsen the condition. Judaism Priests perceived that Jesus Christ was a threat to their well being and wealth. It was unquestionably impossible for them to submit to his teachings, let alone reinstate Judaism with Christianity.
And then Jesus was condemned heretic and blasphemous.
Jesus was betrayed. And Jesus was crucified.
But have Moses’ promise on his Messiah been delivered? The answer is YES.
Ironically, the only last and final prophet that was born after the era of Jesus Christ was born from an Arab family, which made it even more ridiculously impossible for the Jews to accept it as their Messiah. How on earth can the Jews accept an Arab Messiah? When they could not even acknowledged Jesus of Nazareth, a descendant of their great Jewish King Suleiman?
Now do you understand? These are just some of the main reasons why the grudge between Christianity-Judaism and Islam has shaped the face of the world that we know today, and ever since the dawn of time, and from the cradle of our ancient civilization.
The Moslems know it for a fact that Christianity is full of distorted facts and corrupted history and that the Jews are the one who responsible. In the other hand, the Christians and Jews some how believe that Islam has transformed to be a religion of violence and terrorism.
But who is to say that one religion promotes violence, while the other one promotes peace?
We all know for a fact that there has been an apparent abrupt turn of event against the supremacy of the Moslems nations throughout the history. Islam once known as the greater nation has now become the second grade nation which has to endure oppression, aggression and even invasion from the more powerful Christian and Jewish nations.
However, the history taught us that Prophet Muhammad have launched raids, expeditions, military crusades and have waged a full scale wars against the Jews and Christians on his mission to Islamized the world. And that’s the truth.
Yes, Muhammad did wage war on polytheists residing in Mecca with 10,000 Jihadists.
Muhammad did launch a full scale military crusade on Europe with 30,000 Jihadists.
Muhammad did promise virgin-rich gardens in heaven for Jihadists dying in holy war.
But does this justify Islam as the religion that promotes violence and terrorism?
How does an invasion in attempt to religiously pure greater Islam world BE ANY WORSE with an invasion in attempt to strategically reap economic benefits?
Yes! Don’t forget that an economically and better armed greater western nation has been known to invade lesser Islamic eastern nations for economic reasons.
A reasonable, fair and open minded person would now have the right to acknowledge for a fact that any act of terror and violence by the Moslems in any part of the world now is simply just an obvious retaliation against the unjust oppression and invasion from the greater Christian and Jewish nations
So does an act of terrorism carried out by Islamic Jihadists as a practical matter contradict with the notion of ‘Islam as a religion of peace’ as a theoretical matter?
Does this mean Islam is not a religion of peace?
I would like you to consider this Question & Answer (Q&A) for a while:
Q&A
1. Q: What do you call it when a Palestinian youth throws rock to the Jews who have illegally occupied his land?
A: A terrorist attack.
Q: What do you call it when an Israeli Apache Attack-Helicopter fires rockets at Palestinian youths armed with stones?
A: Self-Defense.
2. Q: What do you call a weapon that can kill thousands of people?
A: A weapon of mass destruction (WMD).
Q: What do you call a weapon that has killed more than 2 million Moslems in Iraq and Afghanistan, including more than 500,000 children?
A: U.N Sanctions.
3. Q: What do you call it when 20 Christians or Jewish people are slaughtered?
A: A massacre.
Q: What do you call it when more than 2,000,000 Moslems in Iraq and Afghanistan are slaughtered by the US at a loss of a few hundred American forces (many of whom were killed by friendly fire)?
A: War against Terrorism.
4. Q: What is the name of the leader wrongly accused of trying to create an ethnically pure Greater Serbia?
A: Slobodan Milosevic, ‘war criminal’.
Q: What is the name of the leader trying to annihilate the entire Palestinian Moslems in the attempt to ethnically pure Greater Israel?
A: Ariel Sharon, ‘a man of peace’.
5. Q: What do you call it when innocent Christians or Jews are killed by those resisting a brutal occupation?
A: Terrorism.
Q: What do you call it when millions of innocent Moslems in Palestine, Afghanistan and Iraq are killed by an occupying army?
A: Collateral damage (self-defense).
These Q&A quoted in asserting that Islam is a religion that promotes violence and terrorism.
The Q&A however, flatly contradicts this mere verbal assertion.
The Q&A bluntly proves that ‘Islam is a religion of violence’ is a mere character assassination!
Let the facts speak for itself:
Therefore, Islam is NOT a religion of violence and terrorism.
CONCLUSIONS
1. Is Islam a religion of violence? And Christian and Judaism a religion of peace?
The fact that in theoretical matter, the ‘Prince of Peace’ Jesus Christ in his lifetime has always endorsed love and never waged war and launched a military crusade, and that his martyrdom on the cross has redeemed the Christians a sure passage to heaven so that the world would be free of violence, CONTRADICT the practical matter, in which Christian and Jewish nations have launched military campaigns and waged countless full scale wars with economic motive against Islamic nations with the likes of Palestine, Afghanistan, and Iraq, etc.
So why would a fair-open-minded and reasonable person want submit to the notion that ‘Christian and Judaism are a religion of Peace’, given their nations’ track records?
Given the hard evidences, Christian and Judaism are emphatically NOT a peace religion.
Christian and Judaism are a capitalist and oppressing religion.
2. Does Islam complete Judaism and Christianity?
The fact that Judaism failed to recognize Jesus Christ and his revelations in completing their mission and ministry even though they have been told on what to look for, resulting in prevailing over the Jews incomplete religion. And the fact that Christianity is after all a hybrid man-made corrupted religion created by a Pagan nation, JUSTIFY that the followers of Judaism and Christianity have empirically FAILED to improve their imperfect and far-from-complete religious beliefs.
So does Islam complete Judaism and Christianity?
Given the hard evidences, the answer is an emphatic YES.
Islam simply is the last and final religion that completes and fulfills any of its existing predecessors (including but not limited to Judaism and Christianity).
So go and ask yourself: are you a reasonable, fair and open minded person?
HS. Permadi Aria Wirasmara is an Indonesian who resides in Jakarta.
He is now acting as a Managing Director in a Finance Consultant Co.
“Islam simply is the last and final religion that completes and fulfills any of its existing predecessors (including but not limited to Judaism and Christianity).”
How can you say this as fact? That is your belief. To some people, the true religions is Budhism, to others it is Satanism, Athiesm, etc.
Some of your arguments about American foreign politics is sound…how can you deny that it was Muslims behind the 9.11 attacks. As I understand it Al Qaeda never denied responsibility for the 9.11 attacks. The hijackers were linked to Al Qaeda by several sources, including the media, not just the CIA. This links them all to each other. Very strong evidence.
“Why is the insult so deeply felt by some Muslims?
Of course, there is the prohibition on images of Muhammad.”
But that prohibition applies only to Muslims, as there is no risk that non-Muslims would idolize an image of the Prophet or his companions.
“But one cartoon, showing the Prophet wearing a turban shaped as a bomb with a burning fuse, extends the caricature of Muslims as terrorists to Muhammad.”
It makes the point that the extremists are claiming to be acting as true followers of the Prophet. It is the extremists who have attached that bomb to the head of Mohammed.
One could likewise make an image of Jesus riding into battle with the Medieval Crusaders, waving a sword. It would show that the Crusaders believed they had the support of Jesus for their fighting.
In other words, it is the terorists and crusaders who are the blasphemers, not the cartoonists.
“Given the hard evidences, Christian and Judaism are emphatically NOT a peace religion.”
Oh, all three religions are as bad as each other. The Christians have the least excuse, because the most casual reading of the quotations from Jesus that are included in the Gospels shows that he was strongly against any kind of fighting, even in self-defense.
That doesn’t seem to have much effect on how Christians actually behave.
If Christians had actually followed the teachings of Jesus, they would all have surrendered to Arab imperialism, and the whole of Europe would have become Islamic territory hundreds of years ago.
Watchdog;
You said “Listen, you claimed that radicals killed 3000 of your fellow New Yorkers or whatsoever without any proof except what the CIA have told you what they want you to know”
You said “For example they had the nerve to say that there was a third plane hit the Pentagon, therefore I recommand you to look at this site”
Until people like you give up these silly fantasies, your part of the world will never progress.
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You said “know you for sure you are conceited by youself, you think you guys own the world”
Most of the world is backwards, poor, and dysfunctional. We do not own it, we do not think we own it, and we do not even WANT to own it.
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You said “A reasonable, fair and open minded person would now have the right to acknowledge for a fact that any act of terror and violence by the Moslems in any part of the world now is simply just an obvious retaliation against the unjust oppression and invasion from the greater Christian and Jewish nations”
Any part of the world, says a reasonable, fair, and open-minded person? That’s about as stupid as Christians setting bombs in Cairo because Muslims slaughtered thousands of Christians in East Timor.
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You said “What do you call it when millions of innocent Moslems in Palestine, Afghanistan and Iraq are killed by an occupying army?”
Millions of Muslims were not killed in any of those countries by any occupying army. A few thousand, yes, but not millions.
In fact, the biggest killers of Muslims are other Muslims. Take a look at the last 25 years of Middle-eastern history. You are barking up the wrong tree, Fido.
The rest of your comments are too dumb to answer.
To dumb to answer? Your nation is to dumb, easy as this, wrong + wrong = right? Hell no, terrorests hit your WTC with the knowledge of your government and then 3000 were victims. So, what does your govrnment do? Sends 200,000 soldiers to Iraq and some to Afghanistan do you think thats right? Nearly 3000 soldiers are dead because of your government, why doesn’t your government just tighten-up its domestic regulations and security to prevent such thing in future! Why don’t your government just remove their military basis around Iran, Syria, Bahrain, Qatar, Suadi Arabia, Afghanistan, Pakistan, Kuwait, UAE, Jordan go away. Leave us in peace i.e. the muslims.
You replied to one of my previous posts by mentioning I have fantasies? You think the world has no conspirasies or anything? You think everything you hear in the News is truth? George Bush says there are Weapons of Mass Destruction in Iraq you believe him? Where are the weapons of Mass Destruction in Iraq? Gee, I guess under the palm trees right?
Why does you country have the right to have nuclear power and not Iran? Why does Zionists have hundreds of Nuclear War Heads and your country doesn’t do anything? Infact whenever any country tries to take that to the UN Security Council guess what happens? Fucking America, puts on Veto, fuck! You guys Bombed Japan! You guys hit vietnam, you guys you YOU.
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All you guys who mentioned that there was corruption, in the Abbasids days and Umayyad, and internal wars between arab etc. are none of your business! It is internal issues. Face the fact, God has not sent George Bush, or America to free the world. You guys just watch MTV, jackass, and some of Will and Grace without annoying us. We have corruption in the arab world? So what has that to do with you? Just go home.
Watchdog;
You said “Why don’t your government just remove their military basis around Iran, Syria, Bahrain, Qatar, Suadi Arabia, Afghanistan, Pakistan, Kuwait, UAE, Jordan go away”
The US has no military bases in Iran, Syria, Pakistan, Kuwait, UAE, or Jordan. The US does not even have diplomatic relations with Iran. Syria is openly hostile to it.
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You said “You replied to one of my previous posts by mentioning I have fantasies?”
See response to above.
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You said “We have corruption in the arab world? So what has that to do with you?”
Because your corrupt governments are funding terrorists who are threatening the rest of us. Saudi Arabia is a textbook case.
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You said “God has not sent George Bush, or America to free the world”
A comment I can agree with. Next time there’s a genocide in Kosovo, Bosnia, Rwanda, or Darfur, keep that in mind.
To Great Red Spot and to your American Dream. Have look at what your country “war on terror” helped iraqi people http://www.guardian.co.uk/military/story/0,,1708161,00.html
Watchdog;
Britain and the US are two different countries.
I do not know if you are kid or I am supposed to simplify everything I write. I said look at how America has helped Iraqi people, meaning if America didn’t declare the war “that was supposed to help Iraqi people” they wouldn’t be tortured or humiliated by Britian’s army or any “coalition army”.
You know what, I think as an Arab if I had an option to chose to be tortured or humuliated by my nation’s army or by a foreign army what do you guess I would choose??
Some nice acts from the honest coalition army samples http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,7374-2038149,00.html and http://www.timesonline.co.uk/section/0,,7374,00.html and http://www.newsoftheworld.co.uk/armyvideo.shtml.
They invaded and declared war with the alibi to fight terrorest i.e. Saddam because he helped with the 9/11! Now we never saw anything that relates him to 9/11?? Then he was accused of building weapons of mass destruction!! So where are they? Under the palm trees?? Then they said we are here to bring free iraqi people!! Apparently the term Free in American’s dictionary stands for genocide!! Enjoy your American finest productions at Abu Ghraibhttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abu_Ghraib_torture_and_prisoner_abuse
P.S. I dislike Saddam, so I can not give the wrong impression.
Sorry for the double post.
Watchdog;
If you hate America so much, why don’t you put your money where your mouth is? Boycott all American products. You can start with your computer.
I don’t believe in boycotting, because they have some good food therefore, I don’t believe in boycotting but more rather I would butcher George W. Bush if I see him face to face. But do you think the security services well let me??